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	<title>Comments on: FBI Abuse of &#8220;National Security Letters&#8221; &#8212; New Revelations</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/</link>
	<description>a radical newsletter in the struggle for peace and social justice</description>
	<pubDate>Wed, 20 Aug 2008 20:23:42 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: evie</title>
		<link>http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18940</link>
		<dc:creator>evie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 04:09:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18940</guid>
		<description>Only one page so I read EFF document. 

Mueller states that the NSL was declined and the FBI went back with the subpoena. Sounds like Mueller wanted the SAC to have administrative subpoena power to instantly get the records with a letter. There's no mention of the FBI receiving the information and then having to return it.

Mueller has testified that the number of NSLs issued are not as many as being floated around, and that number comes from typos, incorrect data entry - in other words the usual incompetence.

You may be preaching to the choir though as most folks know  government acronyms are criminal. Even Earl at the diner has a bumper sticker on his Dodge truck that says "I love my country - it's the government that scares me."</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Only one page so I read EFF document. </p>
<p>Mueller states that the NSL was declined and the FBI went back with the subpoena. Sounds like Mueller wanted the SAC to have administrative subpoena power to instantly get the records with a letter. There&#8217;s no mention of the FBI receiving the information and then having to return it.</p>
<p>Mueller has testified that the number of NSLs issued are not as many as being floated around, and that number comes from typos, incorrect data entry - in other words the usual incompetence.</p>
<p>You may be preaching to the choir though as most folks know  government acronyms are criminal. Even Earl at the diner has a bumper sticker on his Dodge truck that says &#8220;I love my country - it&#8217;s the government that scares me.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: evie</title>
		<link>http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18935</link>
		<dc:creator>evie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 03:40:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18935</guid>
		<description>Thanks Tom
Will read that tomorrow. I must nap now before going to bed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Tom<br />
Will read that tomorrow. I must nap now before going to bed.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom Burghardt</title>
		<link>http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18930</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Burghardt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 02:51:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18930</guid>
		<description>evie,

Here's the link from Electronic Frontier Foundation: http://www.eff.org/files/July%2027Transcript.pdf

The hearing was July 27, 2005.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>evie,</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s the link from Electronic Frontier Foundation: <a href="http://www.eff.org/files/July%2027Transcript.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.eff.org/files/July%2027Transcript.pdf</a></p>
<p>The hearing was July 27, 2005.</p>
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		<title>By: evie</title>
		<link>http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18903</link>
		<dc:creator>evie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 19:52:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18903</guid>
		<description>Tom, do you have the date and title of that congressional hearing with Mueller? I've looked through senate.judiciary.gov listings for the testimony but too many to wade through. Thanks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tom, do you have the date and title of that congressional hearing with Mueller? I&#8217;ve looked through senate.judiciary.gov listings for the testimony but too many to wade through. Thanks.</p>
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		<title>By: hp</title>
		<link>http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18902</link>
		<dc:creator>hp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 19:49:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18902</guid>
		<description>How appropriate that El-Qaeda translates to 'the toilet.'</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How appropriate that El-Qaeda translates to &#8216;the toilet.&#8217;</p>
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		<title>By: Tom Burghardt</title>
		<link>http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18892</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Burghardt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 17:27:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18892</guid>
		<description>evie wrote...

"The NSL was served first - worth a try I guess while they waited for the subpoena. "

No, evie, the point of the piece was exactly the opposite. FBI gumshoes already had the subpoena as the result of a federal grand jury. The agents on the ground were ordered by Washington FBIHQ to return documents they already had (!) (el-Nashar's student records) and instead use an illegal NSL to obtain the same records. NCSU correctly refused the request, since NSLs don't cover such records.

Mueller then (falsely) testified before Congress that the FBI needed additional powers under the Patriot Act and specifically cited el-Nashar's case. Ineptness is one thing: does Coleen Rowley ring a bell? Not to mention revelations of corrupt FBI practices brought to light in Peter Lance's 9/11 trilogy, e.g. the strange case of triple agent Ali Mohammed - an al-Qaeda mole, CIA "asset" and FBI informant.

BTW, my point is not to advocate in favor of expanded powers for a national political police force like the FBI, COINTELPRO anyone? Rather, it is to expose their decades-long history of criminality, often at the expense of the grunts who actually try to do legitimate counterterrorism investigations. Yes, the CIA/ISI's frankenstein creation, al-Qaeda, actually would launch mass-casualty attacks again, given the chance. After tens of billions wasted on so-called "homeland security," the best the Bureau can offer is "round up the usual suspects," as the fiasco "trial" of the Miami 7 amply demonstrates. Pathetic.

Same is true with DEA and its so-called "war on drugs": do Mike Levine or Cele Castillo ring a bell? On and on...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>evie wrote&#8230;</p>
<p>&#8220;The NSL was served first - worth a try I guess while they waited for the subpoena. &#8221;</p>
<p>No, evie, the point of the piece was exactly the opposite. FBI gumshoes already had the subpoena as the result of a federal grand jury. The agents on the ground were ordered by Washington FBIHQ to return documents they already had (!) (el-Nashar&#8217;s student records) and instead use an illegal NSL to obtain the same records. NCSU correctly refused the request, since NSLs don&#8217;t cover such records.</p>
<p>Mueller then (falsely) testified before Congress that the FBI needed additional powers under the Patriot Act and specifically cited el-Nashar&#8217;s case. Ineptness is one thing: does Coleen Rowley ring a bell? Not to mention revelations of corrupt FBI practices brought to light in Peter Lance&#8217;s 9/11 trilogy, e.g. the strange case of triple agent Ali Mohammed - an al-Qaeda mole, CIA &#8220;asset&#8221; and FBI informant.</p>
<p>BTW, my point is not to advocate in favor of expanded powers for a national political police force like the FBI, COINTELPRO anyone? Rather, it is to expose their decades-long history of criminality, often at the expense of the grunts who actually try to do legitimate counterterrorism investigations. Yes, the CIA/ISI&#8217;s frankenstein creation, al-Qaeda, actually would launch mass-casualty attacks again, given the chance. After tens of billions wasted on so-called &#8220;homeland security,&#8221; the best the Bureau can offer is &#8220;round up the usual suspects,&#8221; as the fiasco &#8220;trial&#8221; of the Miami 7 amply demonstrates. Pathetic.</p>
<p>Same is true with DEA and its so-called &#8220;war on drugs&#8221;: do Mike Levine or Cele Castillo ring a bell? On and on&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: mohsin gondale</title>
		<link>http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18869</link>
		<dc:creator>mohsin gondale</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 12:02:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18869</guid>
		<description>see and lookinto this matter 
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_can_the_Canadian_Khalid_Awan_get_a_14-year_sentence_in_the_US</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>see and lookinto this matter<br />
<a href="http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_can_the_Canadian_Khalid_Awan_get_a_14-year_sentence_in_the_US" rel="nofollow">http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_can_the_Canadian_Khalid_Awan_get_a_14-year_sentence_in_the_US</a></p>
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		<title>By: hp</title>
		<link>http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18850</link>
		<dc:creator>hp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 03:57:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18850</guid>
		<description>They're also pretty good at strong arming and intimidating ordinary citizens.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>They&#8217;re also pretty good at strong arming and intimidating ordinary citizens.</p>
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		<title>By: evie</title>
		<link>http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18847</link>
		<dc:creator>evie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 03:27:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18847</guid>
		<description>The NSL was served first - worth a try I guess while they waited for the subpoena. Egypt released el-Nashar b/c information obtained was not enough to hold him. Even had they not attempted to use the NSL in this case the outcome would have been the same, and apparently all accomplished within 3 weeks' time.

The FBI has always been incompetent at doing anything other than eavesdropping on high profile figures at the request of other high profile figures.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The NSL was served first - worth a try I guess while they waited for the subpoena. Egypt released el-Nashar b/c information obtained was not enough to hold him. Even had they not attempted to use the NSL in this case the outcome would have been the same, and apparently all accomplished within 3 weeks&#8217; time.</p>
<p>The FBI has always been incompetent at doing anything other than eavesdropping on high profile figures at the request of other high profile figures.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom Burghardt</title>
		<link>http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18800</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Burghardt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Apr 2008 18:28:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18800</guid>
		<description>evie...

I wasn't implying the the IOB was an independent body as my use of quotation marks around the word "independent" should have made clear. My point was, whatever "independence" existed was erased by Bush's February 29 executive order.

Regarding el-Nashar's casual relationship with the 7/7 bombers, no he wasn't held for months or years in Egypt, and yes, he did allow one of the killers to stay in his apartment. My point was not so much a focus on el-Nashar, but rather the backstory, or in the case of the piece, the FBI's use of an NSL that could have potentially sidetracked an investigation into a serious terrorist atrocity.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>evie&#8230;</p>
<p>I wasn&#8217;t implying the the IOB was an independent body as my use of quotation marks around the word &#8220;independent&#8221; should have made clear. My point was, whatever &#8220;independence&#8221; existed was erased by Bush&#8217;s February 29 executive order.</p>
<p>Regarding el-Nashar&#8217;s casual relationship with the 7/7 bombers, no he wasn&#8217;t held for months or years in Egypt, and yes, he did allow one of the killers to stay in his apartment. My point was not so much a focus on el-Nashar, but rather the backstory, or in the case of the piece, the FBI&#8217;s use of an NSL that could have potentially sidetracked an investigation into a serious terrorist atrocity.</p>
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		<title>By: evie</title>
		<link>http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18771</link>
		<dc:creator>evie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Apr 2008 05:24:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/fbi-abuse-of-national-security-letters-new-revelations/#comment-18771</guid>
		<description>The government and its agencies have long had broad powers - it's just higher tech and quicker now.

According to &lt;a href="http://cryptome.org/fbi-nsl/fbi-nsl.htm" rel="nofollow"&gt; cryptome report&lt;/a&gt; on FBI/NSI the FBI was in the process of seeking a grand jury subpoena but presented the university with an NSL, which was declined, and then they were served with the subpoena which they honored and turned over the records. The NSL was not honored  because some of the information the FBI requested was not authorized under the ECPA (Electronic Communications Privacy Act 1986) national security letter.

And indeed, the FBI problems seem to be bureau incompetence, mismanagement, miscommunication, stupidity, employees not knowing their job, sloppy documentation/record keeping, improper authorization, federal paper pushers who want full-time pay for half-ass tasking, etc. 

Also, vacationing el-Nashar was held for 3 weeks in Egypt because he was acquainted with 2 of the London bombers and had given his apartment key to one of them - not something I would do for a casual acquaintance, but others might be more generous and I.  There were initial reports explosive residue was found in his London flat. Wouldn't want to give the impression he was held for months or years.

Every president appoints his buddies to the IOB. As for de-fanging the IOB, you might want to research some of Willie Clinton's executive orders regarding the IOB - it was to report directly to WJC. 

There was something back in 1995, something about Strobe Talbott, Anthony Lake, and Iran arms shipments labeled as humanitarian aid to Croatia/Bosnia, which the Clinton appointed IOB, after "investigating," declared was a-okay, but of course laws were broken.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The government and its agencies have long had broad powers - it&#8217;s just higher tech and quicker now.</p>
<p>According to <a href="http://cryptome.org/fbi-nsl/fbi-nsl.htm" rel="nofollow"> cryptome report</a> on FBI/NSI the FBI was in the process of seeking a grand jury subpoena but presented the university with an NSL, which was declined, and then they were served with the subpoena which they honored and turned over the records. The NSL was not honored  because some of the information the FBI requested was not authorized under the ECPA (Electronic Communications Privacy Act 1986) national security letter.</p>
<p>And indeed, the FBI problems seem to be bureau incompetence, mismanagement, miscommunication, stupidity, employees not knowing their job, sloppy documentation/record keeping, improper authorization, federal paper pushers who want full-time pay for half-ass tasking, etc. </p>
<p>Also, vacationing el-Nashar was held for 3 weeks in Egypt because he was acquainted with 2 of the London bombers and had given his apartment key to one of them - not something I would do for a casual acquaintance, but others might be more generous and I.  There were initial reports explosive residue was found in his London flat. Wouldn&#8217;t want to give the impression he was held for months or years.</p>
<p>Every president appoints his buddies to the IOB. As for de-fanging the IOB, you might want to research some of Willie Clinton&#8217;s executive orders regarding the IOB - it was to report directly to WJC. </p>
<p>There was something back in 1995, something about Strobe Talbott, Anthony Lake, and Iran arms shipments labeled as humanitarian aid to Croatia/Bosnia, which the Clinton appointed IOB, after &#8220;investigating,&#8221; declared was a-okay, but of course laws were broken.</p>
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