Comments on: Bringing Die-hard War Supporters and Feckless War Opponents to Their Knees http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/ a radical newsletter in the struggle for peace and social justice Mon, 13 Oct 2008 14:44:35 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.1 By: Lloyd Rowsey http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6988 Lloyd Rowsey Fri, 05 Oct 2007 20:02:17 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6988 Mulga. I have replied to your post of Sept 4, 2007, on the article "The Fight to Save the Rocky Mountians." lloydrowsey@hotmail.com Mulga. I have replied to your post of Sept 4, 2007, on the article “The Fight to Save the Rocky Mountians.”

lloydrowsey@hotmail.com

]]> By: gerald spezio http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6773 gerald spezio Mon, 01 Oct 2007 23:53:16 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6773 Uhler, do you want the white trash and redneck assholes to come to the general strike. If so, they should dress properly. And no Boston beeah breath either. How can you have a general strike and stop production without the smelly working class, Walter? Uhler, do you want the white trash and redneck assholes to come to the general strike.
If so, they should dress properly.
And no Boston beeah breath either.

How can you have a general strike and stop production without the smelly working class, Walter?

]]> By: Lloyd Rowsey http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6497 Lloyd Rowsey Thu, 27 Sep 2007 15:03:08 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6497 I'm ignorant of the term, johnnie. But reading it in the context of MM's entire post, I'm pretty sure that (s)he is saying that returned, captured American pilots, during and after the Vietnam War, largely went along with the United States media and public portrayal of them as having been severely mistreated by their captors. Whether or not, that is to say, severe mistreatment or torture occurred in a particular pilot's case. This practice was a "big note" because ultimately, at that time, it made it easier and simpler for the returned pilots to readjust. But, needless to say (I love that expression), pilots are not ground soldiers. And then is then and now is now. I'd recommend that you purchase the DVD "The Ground Truth" for data on what readjusting to America can do to ground soldiers returning from Iraq. The DVD was made in 2006, a full 18 months ago if I'm not mistaken. My take on the whole returned pilot matter is: who in America so much as thinks about the impossibility of American pilots being captured unless this country is engaged in a war of aggression against another country? I’m ignorant of the term, johnnie. But reading it in the context of MM’s entire post, I’m pretty sure that (s)he is saying that returned, captured American pilots, during and after the Vietnam War, largely went along with the United States media and public portrayal of them as having been severely mistreated by their captors. Whether or not, that is to say, severe mistreatment or torture occurred in a particular pilot’s case.

This practice was a “big note” because ultimately, at that time, it made it easier and simpler for the returned pilots to readjust. But, needless to say (I love that expression), pilots are not ground soldiers. And then is then and now is now. I’d recommend that you purchase the DVD “The Ground Truth” for data on what readjusting to America can do to ground soldiers returning from Iraq. The DVD was made in 2006, a full 18 months ago if I’m not mistaken.

My take on the whole returned pilot matter is: who in America so much as thinks about the impossibility of American pilots being captured unless this country is engaged in a war of aggression against another country?

]]> By: johnnie http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6467 johnnie Wed, 26 Sep 2007 22:55:07 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6467 lloyd, second to the last sentence in the response from mulga mumblebrain. explanation please. lloyd, second to the last sentence in the response from mulga mumblebrain. explanation please.

]]> By: Lloyd Rowsey http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6422 Lloyd Rowsey Wed, 26 Sep 2007 04:12:44 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6422 Where do you see that, johnnie? Where do you see that, johnnie?

]]> By: johnnie http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6375 johnnie Mon, 24 Sep 2007 22:44:11 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6375 what does "big note" mean? what does “big note” mean?

]]> By: Myles Hoenig http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6318 Myles Hoenig Sun, 23 Sep 2007 13:31:03 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6318 I think a national strike is an excellent idea. Sorry it can't be organized for the first week of October, though, considering that would be when the Supreme Court reconvenes and an acknowledgment by all of us that the US experienced a judicial coup d'etat in 2000. On that matter, I disagree that we need the support of the Democratic Party along with labor to organize this. Labor yes, DP- absolutely NOT. The Democratic Party is no less an accomplice in this war and a willing participant in the coup d'etat. (They refused to stop it or challenge it) The very thought of the Democratic Party being part of an organized effort to end this war is like having the Danes giving the Gestapo the phone book and asking them to warn the Jews. I think a national strike is an excellent idea. Sorry it can’t be organized for the first week of October, though, considering that would be when the Supreme Court reconvenes and an acknowledgment by all of us that the US experienced a judicial coup d’etat in 2000. On that matter, I disagree that we need the support of the Democratic Party along with labor to organize this. Labor yes, DP- absolutely NOT. The Democratic Party is no less an accomplice in this war and a willing participant in the coup d’etat. (They refused to stop it or challenge it)
The very thought of the Democratic Party being part of an organized effort to end this war is like having the Danes giving the Gestapo the phone book and asking them to warn the Jews.

]]> By: Lloyd Rowsey http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6317 Lloyd Rowsey Sun, 23 Sep 2007 13:26:23 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6317 The truth is death But life is living as if it were life The truth is solitude But life is living as if it were community The truth is secrecy But life is living as if it were openness. Where trust departs Is where the ends don’t meet Where a fool at best exposes the game And gets us killed advertently Or inadvertently. Who would compare Europe in1943 With America in 2007? Camus must be spinning in his grave. Every effective resistance has only Endangered itself, Has never proclaimed its strength openly, Has never underestimated the enemy. Let’s just say saving 7300 Jews from the Nazi holocaust Was a different proposition when Advanced electronics was Equivalent To breaking Enigma. Okay? The truth is death
But life is living as if it were life
The truth is solitude
But life is living as if it were community
The truth is secrecy
But life is living as if it were openness.

Where trust departs
Is where the ends don’t meet
Where a fool at best exposes the game
And gets us killed advertently
Or inadvertently.

Who would compare Europe in1943
With America in 2007?
Camus must be spinning in his grave.
Every effective resistance has only
Endangered itself,
Has never proclaimed its strength openly,
Has never underestimated the enemy.

Let’s just say saving 7300 Jews from the Nazi holocaust
Was a different proposition when
Advanced electronics was
Equivalent
To breaking Enigma.

Okay?

]]> By: Mulga Mumblebrain http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6294 Mulga Mumblebrain Sun, 23 Sep 2007 00:59:47 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6294 Having recently heard a broadcast of a speech McCain gave in the UK, and having been amazed and dismayed by his arrogance,chauvinism and ignorance, I'm not at all surprised by his position on Iraq. In my opinion he and all his ilk, have the blood of hundreds of thousands of dead Iraqis on their paws. While a POW of the Vietnamese, McCain alleges he was tortured. I'm disinclined to believe him. While it is well known that the US launched a massive torture and assassination campaign in South Vietnam, along with members of that death squad the so-called ARVN, killing tens of thousands in 'pump (for information, through torture) and dump (the dead bodies)' operations, the most notorious being the Phoenix operation, I do not believe the North Vietnamese tortured captured US pilots. The murderous cowards who rained death on millions from the sky ought, in my opinion to have been strung up when captured. But, then again, I'm of European descent, hence hopelessly blood-thirsty. The Vietnamese turned out to be far more humane and civilised, and fed and watered the likes of McCain for years. On return to the US, the captured pilots decided, I believe, to 'big-note' themselves, and I'm of the opinion that their stories of 'torture' were exaggerated or totally concocted. But that alas, is the 'American Way', at least of that perennially aggressive and racially supremacist strain of Americanism that the likes of Bush, Bolton and McCain represent. Having recently heard a broadcast of a speech McCain gave in the UK, and having been amazed and dismayed by his arrogance,chauvinism and ignorance, I’m not at all surprised by his position on Iraq. In my opinion he and all his ilk, have the blood of hundreds of thousands of dead Iraqis on their paws. While a POW of the Vietnamese, McCain alleges he was tortured. I’m disinclined to believe him. While it is well known that the US launched a massive torture and assassination campaign in South Vietnam, along with members of that death squad the so-called ARVN, killing tens of thousands in ‘pump (for information, through torture) and dump (the dead bodies)’ operations, the most notorious being the Phoenix operation, I do not believe the North Vietnamese tortured captured US pilots. The murderous cowards who rained death on millions from the sky ought, in my opinion to have been strung up when captured. But, then again, I’m of European descent, hence hopelessly blood-thirsty. The Vietnamese turned out to be far more humane and civilised, and fed and watered the likes of McCain for years. On return to the US, the captured pilots decided, I believe, to ‘big-note’ themselves, and I’m of the opinion that their stories of ‘torture’ were exaggerated or totally concocted. But that alas, is the ‘American Way’, at least of that perennially aggressive and racially supremacist strain of Americanism that the likes of Bush, Bolton and McCain represent.

]]> By: Joe http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6265 Joe Sat, 22 Sep 2007 17:55:42 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6265 John McCain is completely brain dead and pretending to be a decision maker for millions of people...the ridiculous marionette show called american politics should ONLY be text of a discarded history book . Most activism is still treating the enormous crimes, the global turmoil as if it's a refusal to put money in a parking meter...impeach they say...we have war criminals like this planet has never seen...it's happening NOW...and the sheepish cry is impeach. The elderly woman said the condition in the u.s. is pathological.........I can't find a word to describe this horror of human behavior...profits from slaughter, profits from rebuilding, profits for the sake of profits, shared only by those who don't need more profits...the sheep ask, please take me to slaughter... John McCain is completely brain dead and pretending to be a decision maker for millions of people…the ridiculous marionette show called american politics should ONLY be text of a discarded history book .

Most activism is still treating the enormous crimes, the global turmoil as if it’s a refusal to put money in a parking meter…impeach they say…we have war criminals like this planet has never seen…it’s happening NOW…and the sheepish cry is impeach. The elderly woman said the condition in the u.s. is pathological………I can’t find a word to describe this horror of human behavior…profits from slaughter, profits from rebuilding, profits for the sake of profits, shared only by those who don’t need more profits…the sheep ask, please take me to slaughter…

]]> By: Mark Kaplan http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6255 Mark Kaplan Sat, 22 Sep 2007 16:07:15 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/09/bringing-die-hard-war-supporters-and-feckless-war-opponents-to-their-knees/#comment-6255 I agree that the organization of a 'general strike' across the nation, for the first Tuesday in November, is and could be a great idea. But it needs the support of the labor movement, the Democratic Party -- and a host of private not-for-profit organizations promoting economic justice, and a halt to the occupation of Iraq. Such a campaign needs to be backed with tens of millions of dollars - and a commensurate media effort, at all levels -- for it to have any impact. I agree that the organization of a ‘general strike’ across the nation, for the first Tuesday in November, is and could be a great idea. But it needs the support of the labor movement, the Democratic Party — and a host of private not-for-profit organizations promoting economic justice, and a halt to the occupation of Iraq. Such a campaign needs to be backed with tens of millions of dollars - and a commensurate media effort, at all levels — for it to have any impact.

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