Comments on: The Pro-Israel Lobby and US Middle East Policy http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/05/the-pro-israel-lobby-and-us-middle-east-policy/ a radical newsletter in the struggle for peace and social justice Sun, 06 Jul 2008 21:45:16 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5.1 By: tentmaker.org » The Pro-Israel Lobby and US Middle East Policy http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/05/the-pro-israel-lobby-and-us-middle-east-policy/#comment-531 tentmaker.org » The Pro-Israel Lobby and US Middle East Policy Wed, 23 May 2007 18:40:05 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/05/the-pro-israel-lobby-and-us-middle-east-policy/#comment-531 [...] http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/05/the-pro-israel-lobby-and-us-middle-east-policy/ Score Card for 2007 by James Peteras/ May 17th, 2007 Never in recent history has US Middle East policy been subject to such a barrage of conflicting pressures from erstwhile allies, clients as well as adversaries. The points of contention involve fundamental issues of war and peace, foremost of which are divergent responses to the Palestinian-Israeli conflict, the US-Iranian confrontation, the US occupation of Iraq as well as the US-Ethiopian proxy invasion and occupation of Somalia. [...] [...] http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/05/the-pro-israel-lobby-and-us-middle-east-policy/ Score Card for 2007 by James Peteras/ May 17th, 2007 Never in recent history has US Middle East policy been subject to such a barrage of conflicting pressures from erstwhile allies, clients as well as adversaries. The points of contention involve fundamental issues of war and peace, foremost of which are divergent responses to the Palestinian-Israeli conflict, the US-Iranian confrontation, the US occupation of Iraq as well as the US-Ethiopian proxy invasion and occupation of Somalia. [...]

]]> By: Ariadna http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/05/the-pro-israel-lobby-and-us-middle-east-policy/#comment-343 Ariadna Fri, 18 May 2007 05:33:30 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/05/the-pro-israel-lobby-and-us-middle-east-policy/#comment-343 Superb article. The most cogent analysis of ZPC in the US and its ongoing nefarious consequences, not only for the Palestinian people but for the American people, the Iraqi and the entire ME, and continuing to spread. As for what someone called a "bogus quote"--it is inexact but not "bogus." If it was falsely reported in the Israeli press then that too is symptomatic of the Israeli smug arrogance vis-a-vis its host (in the biological sense of the word: "During an argument between the Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon and Foreign Minister Shimon Peres, Peres said that Isralis' policies of continued violence might "turn the US against us". To this Sharon retorted: "EVERY TIME WE DO SOMETHING, YOU TELL ME AMERICANS WILL DO THIS AND WILL DO THAT. I WANT TO TELL YOU SOMETHING VERY CLEAR: DON'T WORRY ABOUT AMERICAN PRESSURE ON ISRAEL; WE, THE JEWISH PEOPLE, CONTROL AMERICA. AND THE AMERICANS KNOW IT." -- Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon October 3, 2001 (IAP News) Sharon’s claim broadcast by Israel Radio on 3 October 2001. At the time Sharon was berating Foreign Minister Shimon Peres in Cabinet. “Every time we do something you tell me America will do this and will do that . . . I want to tell you something very clear: Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We, the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it.” JERUSALEM -- An acrimonious argument erupted during the Israeli cabinet weekly session last week between Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon and his foreign Minister Shimon Peres during which Sharon reportedly yelled at Peres, saying "don't worry about American pressure, we control America." According the Israeli Hebrew radio Kol Yisrael Wednesday, Peres warned Sharon that refusing to heed incessant American requests for a cease-fire with the Palestinians would endanger Israeli interests and turn the US against us. At this point, a furious Sharon reportedly turned toward Peres, saying "every time we do something you tell me America will do this and will do that . . . I want to tell you something very clear: Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We, the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it." The radio said Peres and other cabinet ministers warned Sharon against saying what he said in public, because "it would cause us a public relations disaster." Of course the Israeli can claim (a) it never happened; (b) no such reports were made public; or (c) this is the stuff of "anti-semitic" urban legend. It is not surprising--they also claim Jenin was a small brawl, all slaughters of Palestinian civilians are accidental and Israel is a ... democracy. The same poster speaks laudatively of Gush Shalom. Is Zionism Lite less lethal? Superb article. The most cogent analysis of ZPC in the US and its ongoing nefarious consequences, not only for the Palestinian people but for the American people, the Iraqi and the entire ME, and continuing to spread.
As for what someone called a “bogus quote”–it is inexact but not “bogus.” If it was falsely reported in the Israeli press then that too is symptomatic of the Israeli smug arrogance vis-a-vis its host (in the biological sense of the word:
“During an argument between the Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon and Foreign Minister Shimon Peres, Peres said that Isralis’ policies of continued violence might “turn the US against us”.

To this Sharon retorted:

“EVERY TIME WE DO SOMETHING, YOU TELL ME AMERICANS WILL DO THIS AND WILL DO THAT. I WANT TO TELL YOU SOMETHING VERY CLEAR: DON’T WORRY ABOUT AMERICAN PRESSURE ON ISRAEL;

WE, THE JEWISH PEOPLE, CONTROL AMERICA. AND THE AMERICANS KNOW IT.”

– Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon
October 3, 2001
(IAP News)

Sharon’s claim broadcast by Israel Radio on 3 October 2001. At the time Sharon was berating Foreign Minister Shimon Peres in Cabinet.
“Every time we do something you tell me America will do this and will do that . . . I want to tell you something very clear: Don’t worry about American pressure on Israel. We, the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it.”

JERUSALEM — An acrimonious argument erupted during the Israeli cabinet weekly session last week between Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon and his foreign Minister Shimon Peres during which Sharon reportedly yelled at Peres, saying “don’t worry about American pressure, we control America.”

According the Israeli Hebrew radio Kol Yisrael Wednesday, Peres warned Sharon that refusing to heed incessant American requests for a cease-fire with the Palestinians would endanger Israeli interests and turn the US against us.

At this point, a furious Sharon reportedly turned toward Peres, saying “every time we do something you tell me America will do this and will do that . . . I want to tell you something very clear: Don’t worry about American pressure on Israel. We, the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it.”

The radio said Peres and other cabinet ministers warned Sharon against saying what he said in public, because “it would cause us a public relations disaster.”

Of course the Israeli can claim (a) it never happened; (b) no such reports were made public; or (c) this is the stuff of “anti-semitic” urban legend.
It is not surprising–they also claim Jenin was a small brawl, all slaughters of Palestinian civilians are accidental and Israel is a … democracy.
The same poster speaks laudatively of Gush Shalom. Is Zionism Lite less lethal?

]]> By: Concete man http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/05/the-pro-israel-lobby-and-us-middle-east-policy/#comment-306 Concete man Thu, 17 May 2007 09:53:33 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/05/the-pro-israel-lobby-and-us-middle-east-policy/#comment-306 I am a big Petras fan, so I am biased, but I read everything he writes with a critical eye and occasionally disagree, but rarely. When I promoted this article to a Trot friend, he called me a "racist bigot" for Petras' supposed downplaying of Big Oil's role in the Iraq war. My "friend" (ex, now I guess) is not Jewish. I would like to see what Petras has to say in more detail regarding the Holocaust given that many people posit that it is the foundational stone of the ZPC. Also, did the Zios do 9-11? Some people think so. Or more precisely, the ZPC. I am a big Petras fan, so I am biased, but I read everything he writes with a critical eye and occasionally disagree, but rarely.

When I promoted this article to a Trot friend, he called me a “racist bigot” for Petras’ supposed downplaying of Big Oil’s role in the Iraq war. My “friend” (ex, now I guess) is not Jewish.

I would like to see what Petras has to say in more detail regarding the Holocaust given that many people posit that it is the foundational stone of the ZPC. Also, did the Zios do 9-11? Some people think so. Or more precisely, the ZPC.

]]> By: Rowan Berkeley http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/05/the-pro-israel-lobby-and-us-middle-east-policy/#comment-253 Rowan Berkeley Tue, 15 May 2007 13:36:33 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/05/the-pro-israel-lobby-and-us-middle-east-policy/#comment-253 further regarding what I hold to be a bogus quote (not that it matters immensely, political anecdote is inherently anarchic) : when I said it had been bogusly sourced to haaretz, my memory was playing tricks on me. It was bogusly sourced to kol israel radio. further regarding what I hold to be a bogus quote (not that it matters immensely, political anecdote is inherently anarchic) : when I said it had been bogusly sourced to haaretz, my memory was playing tricks on me. It was bogusly sourced to kol israel radio.

]]> By: gerald spezio http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/05/the-pro-israel-lobby-and-us-middle-east-policy/#comment-244 gerald spezio Mon, 14 May 2007 22:30:40 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/05/the-pro-israel-lobby-and-us-middle-east-policy/#comment-244 Mr. Petras, your incisive work is the primary force trying to expose the Israeli influence on the world's future. I say trying because we realize how powerful and successful their peeyar has been. I have limited success with my educated friends. Two questions for you to answer. What percentage of U,S. citizens would agree with your essay? What hope is there for exposing this Israeli racist monstrosity? No question that Hillary is poised to keep the Israeli murder machine humming. Mr. Petras, your incisive work is the primary force trying to expose the Israeli influence on the world’s future. I say trying because we realize how powerful and successful their peeyar has been. I have limited success with my educated friends.
Two questions for you to answer. What percentage of U,S. citizens would agree with your essay? What hope is there for exposing this Israeli racist monstrosity? No question that Hillary is poised to keep the Israeli murder machine humming.

]]> By: Rowan Berkeley http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/05/the-pro-israel-lobby-and-us-middle-east-policy/#comment-239 Rowan Berkeley Mon, 14 May 2007 18:45:54 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/05/the-pro-israel-lobby-and-us-middle-east-policy/#comment-239 I agree with the whole thing, factually, except that this quote: As former Israel Prime Minister Ariel Sharon once said: “We tell him (Bush) what to do, and he does it.” was bogusly sourced to Haaretz and is phony. In terms of drawing conclusions, I remain a supporter of Gush Shalom until they're all dead or driven out of the country, because they are the only basis for internal national resistance. I agree with the whole thing, factually, except that this quote:

As former Israel Prime Minister Ariel Sharon once said: “We tell him (Bush) what to do, and he does it.”

was bogusly sourced to Haaretz and is phony.

In terms of drawing conclusions, I remain a supporter of Gush Shalom until they’re all dead or driven out of the country, because they are the only basis for internal national resistance.

]]> By: bobw http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/05/the-pro-israel-lobby-and-us-middle-east-policy/#comment-236 bobw Mon, 14 May 2007 18:01:00 +0000 http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/05/the-pro-israel-lobby-and-us-middle-east-policy/#comment-236 Superb, lucid, comprehensive summary of Israeli influence on US policies and policy-makers. Some of Petras' observations are extremely subtle -- for example, the perception of Bush and Cheney as stuck with the tar-baby of Iraq while Israel heedlessly pushes them toward further embroilment in Iran. When Petras comments that Israel's "current political class" is incapable of making any of the changes required for a resolution of the Palestinian issue, I wonder if he means there is no possibility of political change in Israel? I have read that young Israeli professionals are increasingly emigrating for better prospects or safer lives, which gives the impression that the Israeli electorate will increasingly be older and more right-wing. Jonathan Nitzan (York University in Canada) describes Israel's economic elite as pursuing the same shift to global investment as America's, abandoning its own domestic constituency. This, and the demographic issue, leads some commentators to say the Israeli national experiment is doomed. And the US seems to be willing to follow this baneful influence to its self-destructive end. Superb, lucid, comprehensive summary of Israeli influence on US policies and policy-makers. Some of Petras’ observations are extremely subtle — for example, the perception of Bush and Cheney as stuck with the tar-baby of Iraq while Israel heedlessly pushes them toward further embroilment in Iran.

When Petras comments that Israel’s “current political class” is incapable of making any of the changes required for a resolution of the Palestinian issue, I wonder if he means there is no possibility of political change in Israel? I have read that young Israeli professionals are increasingly emigrating for better prospects or safer lives, which gives the impression that the Israeli electorate will increasingly be older and more right-wing. Jonathan Nitzan (York University in Canada) describes Israel’s economic elite as pursuing the same shift to global investment as America’s, abandoning its own domestic constituency. This, and the demographic issue, leads some commentators to say the Israeli national experiment is doomed.

And the US seems to be willing to follow this baneful influence to its self-destructive end.

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